Song translations?

Hi all,

My friend and I are harpists and singers. We occasionally perform songs I've translated (poorly!) into Sindarin and Quenya. They're fun at ren fests.

I'm working on translating a new song and was wondering if I could get some advice. I'm working on Wendy Waldman's Pirate Ships (www.youtube.com). The lyrics (www.lyrics.com) can be found there.

There's a few words that have been giving me some trouble. Please excuse my transcription/transalliterations, these are from my lyrics sheets.

Hinya hinya

I'd love it if this were one syllable and also maybe started with a vowel or sharper sound. When sang, it sounds like 'inyah', which is like, fine, but could be better.

Any suggestions for a monosyllabic word for dear, child, babe, baby, beloved, etc?

Silome silomë

This seems to be a pretty well-accepted word for tonight. Unfortunately, it's one more syllable than I'd like. When sang/performed, it sounds like sloh-may, which I think could be improved. It looks lovely on the page, but some alternatives would be appreciated.

Lirale canya lirale canya

This is my translation for 'merry and bold', and it's just too many syllables, I think, unless I'm pronouncing it wrong.

Is Lirale pronounced leer-uh-lay, or leer-ahl?

Other comments

Most other things I've been reasonably satisfied with. See the people in the stars translates unexpectedly well. I will sleep/right down beside you isn't quite so clear. If you're curious, I've translated that as 'Amme lóre / (Ara-)torne ara-tye'.

Suggestions, comments, and links to other songs folks have already translated are very welcome. I'm doing this for the joy of it-- I know it won't be perfect. :)

If you're curious, here (voca.ro) is a link to a quick, un-accompanied recording of my translation of the first verse.

I'm not seeing a ton of activity here, so I won't hold my breath for responses... But I thought folks here might appreciate a little more info/process for how the translation stands now. Maybe there's not much discussion because my initial post seemed a bit disconnected of labor/context? Or just boring, IDK.

I just guessed on anything resembling grammar (and pronunciation, at that). Suggestions/hourly rates welcome.

Au-hae, / Far away

Au-hae, hinya. / Far away, child.

Cín hendu / Turn your eyes

Au-hae hinya / Far away, child

Amme lóre / I will sleep

(Ara-)torne ara-tye/Right down beside you

Silome/Tonight

Amme lóre / I will sleep

Silome/Tonight

.

Cir-in-do (ship of liars?-- seemed good enough)/ Pirate ships

Cirindo, hinya ,/ Pirate ships, child

Lirale canya / Merry and bold

Alcar alya, hinya / Sparkling and rich, child

Tenuva cir, / Coming to dock

Se cin tali / Right at your feet

Silome / Tonight

Tenuva cir, / Coming to dock

Silome / Tonight

.

Elenion, / In the stars

Elenion, hinya / In the stars, child

Cen-i nórë / See the people

Elenion, hinya / In the stars, child.

Te lut-lelya / They will sail

Lintie ter lattilya / "right through your window" (no idea how that one went)

Silome / Tonight,

(Ter) Lattilya / They will sail

Silome / Tonight.

.

Au-hae / Far away,

Au-hae, hinya / Far away, child,

Cin hendu / Turn your eyes...

Au-hae, hinya / far away, child.

Amme lóre / Mama will sleep,

(Ara-)torne ara-tye / Right down beside you,

Silome / Tonight,

Amme lóre / Mama will sleep,

Silome / Tonight.

Amme lóre / Mama will sleep

Silome. / Tonight.

Here's an existing recording, I spent some time re-hashing a translation tonight, so maybe we'll be a little more complete next season. Here's tonight's work:

Oh, Dannui ionn, i pipes, i pipes nall-ed-o!

Tûm na tûm, a dad i orod plual ered haer.

I laer lelya-, a quanda meril talt,

Ná-cin, ná-cin boe glenn-a im boe dar.

Ar tul-tye dan ir laer's mîg i laire,

Ben ir i imlad pell a thilivern na loss,

Ha atha-im n-hi nu aurë ben nu gwathren,

Oh, Dannui ionn, oh Dannui ionn, im mel cin ter!

Hey Liriel

It seems I missed your first post. Apologies for making you wait.

Unfortunately I can see little to no grammar in these translations. Using a dictionary without understanding of the underlying grammatical principles cannot lead to anything resembling a correct translation. Aside from the grammar, there's also the issue of some word choices, e.g. using the Quenya verb lelya- in the Sindarin text, using outdated ionn instead of iond etc.

Your pronunciation in the first recording (I cannot access the second recording) also requires much correcting.

For pronunciation matters I suggest you take a look at Appendix E in The Lord of the Rings; I can also direct you to online resources if you don't have the book.

As for the translations themselves, it is a little much to comment on at the moment. Nor would my comments be of much use, unless you want to learn proper Elvish grammar - in which case I can direct you to study resources.

If, however, you are only interested in a "'final product", a finished and correct translation, then we can see how to go about achieving that. I could have a go at a Sindarin translation myself, and I could direct you to an excellent expert of Quenya (though she might not have much free time in the next week or two), but this would indeed require some kind of commission I'm afraid.

Thank you for your thoughtful reply, Ellanto. In short, I thought as much. I appreciate you taking a look at things.

At this stage, a commission sounds quite interesting-- I tend to be a very stubborn learner. Is there a good way to contact you regarding a commission?