Subjunctive in Quenya

Tom Bombadil #168

Hi, I would like to use Quenya in an everydaystile, at least in theory, and therefore I am searching for polite ways to express wishes. Of course there is an imperative, but "give me a waterglass" is not very polite. Of course "mecin" could be used as "please", but "give me a waterglass, please" is still not polite enough in my opinion. I think, the best would be to use the subjunctive in a leading question, maybe even combined with please, like "Could you give me a waterglass, please?".

So: does a way exist to put verbs in the subjunctive? It should be possible, for Tolkien also created imperative and indicative, so subjunctive would be the last missing mode.

The words for "if" do already exist, like cé and qui, but how are sentences created with that? I mean: what is the syntax like, and how have the verbs to be? Like the tenses in the three english if-clauses? Are there precedents how Tolkien used it?

One more thing: I thought, maybe the suffix -ce could make a verb a subjunctive one. At least there is a precedent: náce, but for two reasons I am still sceptic.

At first -ce is added to the verb in the present tense, not to the stem. That sounds unusual. Secondly na is such a fundamental word that I am not sure if we will be able to reason any linguistic rule on this fundament (and of course one single word is not enough to deduce a rule).

Anyway, what do you think? Could I say for instance "lertace" (stem+ce), or maybe "lerteace" (present tense+ce) for "could"? Or do you know other ways for if-clauses and subjunctive verbs?

I'm grateful for any answer.

Aldaleon #183

Hi!

Have you seen ecë nin care sa, potential mood using quí and Hypothetical mood using cé ?

There are some information about this in Parma Eldalamberon 22. An excerpt from Quenya Verbal System from the 1940s:

The modifications of sense, and implication corresponding to the 'moods': subjunctive, injunctive, optative, etc.: of modern European languages were not in Eldarin languages expressed inflexionally in the common period. The normal or 'indicative' forms indeed were used without modification, where the context made it clear that a sentence was not narrative or statement of fact. Or indeed even when the whole tone and trend of the narrative, situation, or conversation would not have made it clear to Men. To the Eldar an entire narrative of invention (about things or events not supposed or known in Ea) needed a "suppositional" form or indicator in its verbs as much, or as little, as the expression of a wish, or the definition of a possible event contingent on if or an if-clause, or indeed of a 'statement' in the 'future' - other than prophecy.

There existed, however, already in Eldarin certain adverbial particles, of possibility, re­moter possibility, supposition, and wish, that could be used for greater precision. These were placed in close connexion with [the] verb. Most frequently they appear to have immediately preceded it. But they could follow it; and in cases where (while the primitive collocations of pronominal affixes and adverbial adjuncts had not yet been agglutinated into inseparable inflexional forms) they preceded the pronouns the germs of modal inflexion were already to hand.

You can buy the book on Parma Eldalamberon's website.

There are some interesting sentences there too:

quistanyes, lá istan "I suppose so, I do not know."
qui(ta) la tuldes, náne márie (nin) "if he had not come, I was glad"
an ké mo queme kendele númenna, ve senya, i hyarma tentane Melcorello "for if one turned the face westwards as was usual, the left hand pointed away from Melkor."

Tom Bombadil #206

Thank you very much for your detailed answer, Aldaleon. Especially the Parma Eldalamberon excerpt helps me and also the sentence care mára quí tyare naxa was unknown to me. In case of doubt I will just use the aorist/infinitive in both sub-clauses. Thanks once again!